'Globally-Visible Packages' not shown by 'M-x guix-installed-packages'

In guixSD, 'Globally-Visible Packages' packages installed accoding to

'7.2.1 Using the Configuration System' are not shown by 'M-x

guix-installed-packages' and are shown as uninstalled in the 'M-x

guix-all-packages' 'list' buffers.

myglc2 (2016-02-08 18:08 +0300) wrote:

"M-x guix-installed-packages" shows the packages installed in a current

profile (which is ~/.guix-profile by default), the same way as "guix

package --list-installed" does. You can prefix this command with C-u to

choose a profile you want. See also (info "(guix) Emacs Commands").

If you want to look at the packages installed globally, you can run "M-x

guix-system-generations" and press RET on the latest generation (I think

for convenience we can add "M-x guix-system-packages" command).

--

Alex

Alex Kost <alezost@gmail.com> skribis:

Indeed, this is not a bug to me.

myglc2: if you think anything is unclear in the documentation, let us

know how we could improve it!

Thanks,

Ludo’.

tags 22600 notabug

ludo@gnu.org (Ludovic Courtès) writes:

WOW! That IS a beautiful thing. And, the Guix Pack Info ... AWESOME!

SIDEBAR:

I hope it is OK that I am taking the liberty of reporting things that

seem counterintutive or difficult to understand in the bugs

channel. These may well be operator error or misunderstandings on my

part. I am happy to report in a different channel if that is better. Or

to have you say, "enough of this!"

About me: I want to never learn another distribution, package manager,

configuration approach, or deployment manager. So I really want you to

succeed. I have spent ~ 3 weeks studying and using Nix, NixOS and

guixSD. I have used computers to build models since 1975 and I hope to

use guix in my next work. I figure that if something puzzles me, it may

be puzzeling to others and a barrier to guix' adoption. I want to help

reduce such barriers.

I am writing in the first person to convey the way that I visualize that

your new users, which hopefully will come and stay to play, might

experience guix. It is not my intent to pick on guix or the doc, both of

which are truly outstanding.

BACK TO THE "BUG"

Yes, it is probably not a bug in a technical sense and/or given the way

you conceptualize guix. But, at the risk of being a bore, may I please

restate:

It seemed really counterintuitive that when I did ...

'M-x guix-installed packages'

... I saw ...

"No package outputs installed in profile '/var/guix/profiles/per-user/glc/guix-profile'."

My concern is that this experience might leave a new user thinking,

"Geez, I know back in the fog of the USB install I added packages. What

kind of package manager is this? It doesn't show me the packages that I

painfully typed in using zile at the console". IMO this is the kind of

doubt that can undermine confidence during the critical first few hours

of software test driving and lead a user to abandon the experment.

My own experience: I had been going back to the config.scm files or

typing 'which' to see what was installed. I knew there were generations.

But believe it or not, in the course of working with guixSD for ~ 10

days, I had not used ...

1) "M-x guix-system-generations"

2) press RET on the latest generation

So say I am a dummy. I am fine with that.

But, wouldn't it be better to combine these functions so even a duummy

will see all the packages?

Maybe later, for the roadmap?

myglc2 (2016-02-09 05:29 +0300) wrote:

[...]

I think it's ok to do it in bugs. Perhaps guix-devel ML will be more

suitable, but I don't know.

And thank you for this!

I would say that a user should get acquainted with the basic concepts of

Guix before using it. I think per-user package management is one of such

concepts, and it is described in the beginning of (info "(guix) Features")

section of the manual.

As I suggested in the previous mail, we can add "M-x guix-system-packages".

Maybe it would be good to add "M-x guix-user-packages", or maybe name them:

- guix-installed-system-packages (for /run/current-system/profile)

- guix-installed-user-packages (for ~/.guix-profile)

And to leave "M-x guix-installed-packages" for an arbitrary profile

specified by a user. WDYT?

--

Don't install packages globally, use a user profile!

Alex Kost <alezost@gmail.com> writes:

Per-user features are very important for guix adopters. But as

described in my other post, global (aka system) features are equally

important for guixSD adopters. It is fantastic that guix + guixSD

support both use cases.

OTOH, these use cases appear to be fighting against each other. This

makes the documentation hard to write and understand. It makes the

user interface hard to do. If we let the conflict get out of control

it will confuse the marketplace and undermine guix/SD.

So we need to embrace and understand this natural yin and yang in a

great solution that spans user, package, distribution, and system

managment. If we can do that I think guix/SD will be very successful.

I like it. I tried to summarize what I think I understand in the table

below. Could you take a look and fix it up?

| Recipe Source | install | Profile | UI access | Scope | Generations |

|-------------------------+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+--------------------------------------+--------+-----------------------------|

| guix pull | sudo guix system reconfigure <config> | /run/current-system/profile | * M-x guix-installed-system-packages | global | M-x guix-system-generations |

| guix pull | guix -i <package> | ~/.guix-profile | * M-x guix-installed-user-packages | global | M-x guix-generations |

| | | | | | |

| git pull w/wo user mods | [env]$ sudo ./pre-inst-env guix system reconfigure ../configs/config.k.scm | /run/current-system/profile | * M-x guix-installed-system-packages | user | M-x guix-system-generations |

| git pull w/wo user mods | ??? | ~/.guix-profile | * M-x guix-installed-user-packages | user | M-x guix-generations |

| | | | | | |

| <user custom> | ??? | <user specfied> | M-x guix-installed-packages | ouser | ??? |

| | | | | | |

Notes:

??? - don't know

myglc2 (2016-02-10 05:30 +0300) wrote:

[...]

guix package -i <package>

I don't understand what "w/wo user mods" means, but if you are talking

about running guix commands using a git repo; "pre-inst-env" is the way

to go, for example: "./pre-inst-env guix package -i ..."

For a custom package (if that's what you mean), it's the same: "guix

package -i <user-package>", but at first you need to add a directory

with your packages to GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH as described in the manual:

(info "(guix) Package Modules")

If you want to install packages in an arbitrary profile, run "guix

package" command with "--profile=..." option.

Also I don't understand what "scope" column means.

--

Alex

Alex Kost <alezost@gmail.com> writes:

[...]

That "official" guix recipes in local repo may be modified.

Revised table:

** Sources of and ways to install packages in guixSD

| Recipe source | avail to | recipe upgrade | location | package install | profile | display packages | display generations |

|-----------------------+----------+----------------+------------+------------------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+----------------------------------------+-----------------------------|

| guix ??? | system | guix pull | /gnu/store | sudo guix system reconfigure <config.scm> | /run/current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| guix ??? | user | guix pull | /gnu/store | sudo guix package -i <package> | ~/.guix-profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-user-packages | M-x guix-generations |

| guix git repo | system | (2) git pull | PWD | [env]$ sudo ./pre-inst-env guix system reconfigure <configs.scm> | /current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| guix git repo | user | (2) git pull | PWD | [env]$ sudo ./pre-inst-env guix package -i <package> | ~/.guix-profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-user-packages | M-x guix-generations |

| <user-dir>/<user.scm> | system | N/A | <user-dir> | sudo guix system reconfigure <config.scm w/ user-package> | /run/current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| <user-dir>/<user.scm> | user | N/A | <user-dir> | (3) [env]$ sudo guix package -i <user-package> | ~/.guix-profile | M-x guix-installed-packages | M-x guix-generations |

|-----------------------+----------+----------------+------------+------------------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+----------------------------------------+-----------------------------|

Notes:

(1) proposed

(2) Recipes obtained this way may be modified by the user. Set up the guix git repo as described in the manual (info "(guix) Building from Git").

(3) Add <user-dir> to GUIX_PACKAGE_PATH as described in the manual (info "(guix) Package Modules")

Trying to help a new user get their bearings. What do you think?

myglc2 (2016-02-10 23:25 +0300) wrote:

[...]

I received this table corrupted, I hope the following one will survive

the mail sending.

| Recipe source | avail to | recipe upgrade | location | package install | profile | display packages | display generations |

|-----------------------+----------+----------------+------------+------------------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+----------------------------------------+-----------------------------|

| guix ??? | system | guix pull | /gnu/store | sudo guix system reconfigure <config.scm> | /run/current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| guix ??? | user | guix pull | /gnu/store | sudo guix package -i <package> | ~/.guix-profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-user-packages | M-x guix-generations |

| guix git repo | system | (2) git pull | PWD | [env]$ sudo ./pre-inst-env guix system reconfigure <configs.scm> | /current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| guix git repo | user | (2) git pull | PWD | [env]$ sudo ./pre-inst-env guix package -i <package> | ~/.guix-profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-user-packages | M-x guix-generations |

| <user-dir>/<user.scm> | system | N/A | <user-dir> | sudo guix system reconfigure <config.scm w/ user-package> | /run/current-system/profile | (1) M-x guix-installed-system-packages | M-x guix-system-generations |

| <user-dir>/<user.scm> | user | N/A | <user-dir> | (3) [env]$ sudo guix package -i <user-package> | ~/.guix-profile | M-x guix-installed-packages | M-x guix-generations |

|-----------------------+----------+----------------+------------+------------------------------------------------------------------+-----------------------------+----------------------------------------+-----------------------------|

It looks ok to me except you use "sudo" everywhere. This may be

misleading as "sudo" is not needed when a user installs a package in a

his/her profile.

--

Alex

Alex Kost (2016-02-09 22:21 +0300) wrote:

[...]

These commands are added in commit cfb1c62.

--

Alex